Forum:Territory application/TA032 - Aldevira

Forums → Territory application → Territory application/TA032 - Aldevira

Please fill in the information below to make a territory request.

	Territory ID and proposed name
	The Territory ID (from OpenGeofiction:Territories, e.g. AR123a) and proposed name of the country

TA032^∈^⊾ - Aldevira (Republic of)

	Physical geography
	An overview of climate, topography and landscape of the country. It is advised to also create a sketch, you can add a link to this (hosted on imgur or similar)

Aldevira is a federation of four main islands (and some more smaller islands). The islands are similar in geography. The largest island, Aldevira is home to three mountain ranges, The Pinnacle Mountains (Gran Pico), the Saint George Mountains (Saint Jorge) and the Flesh Mountains (Montañas De Carne). The rest of the island is mostly forested with meadows and fams dotted across the landscape. Towns and villages are densely stitched together in South Aldevira. In North Aldevira (and the rest of the islands except Toçi ) population is much scarcer in the countryside, but gets very dense in urban areas. The region has a Tropical Rainforest Climate (Af on the Köppen-Geiger Climate Classification)

below is a sketch of Aldevira. It includes some lore for the islands, mountains, provinces, parishes, and major cities.

https://imgur.com/94jHO3Y

	Human geography
	A brief description of the territory demographics, economic development, land occupation, infrastructure and mapping style

The country in total has a population of around 1.5 Million. The largest city is Zavor, in South Aldevira. In order of population, the other major cities are as follows: Debut, Gardi, Capia, Tavori, Port Gai. Debut is the capital, and judicial centre of the country. Damia is the economic centre. Port Gai is regarded as the largest settlement in the country with no colonial influence. Most cities are town-sized.

Public transit is left up to provincial governments, meaning some will have better connection than others.

Railway transport only exists in Karnova and Tavora, ran by National Railways, the Tavora Railroad, the Damia Transit Authority or the Capitol Rapid Transit (CaRT). A series of ferries connect the islands.

Administratively, the country is divided into six provinces, North Aldevira, South Aldevira, Toçi , Limain Island, Burnsey Shore and New Ledbury. These provinces are further divided into parishes or city districts.

The population in Tavora is rising steadily, as more work becomes available. The country (especially Tavora) is attractive to companies due to its well educated workforce, low corporation tax and the fact that Ingerish is spoken. Aldevira is regarded as a tax haven, and I hope to collaborate with some Tarephian countries to set up int'l headquarters in cities like New Ledbury.

Tourism is a major money-maker in Aldevira, accounting for 20% of the country's income. The main holiday destinations are Toçi and Limain, though tourists also visit the other parts of the country. Its beautiful beaches and clear seas attract tourists from across the world. The largest and busiest airport in the country is Damia Neziri International Airport.

Aldevira has an aging population. Most young people are moving to the cities or in the worst cases leaving the country for Uletha. Tavora is the most well-off region in the country.

Highways, given the A prefix link together major towns and cities. They go all accross the country.

Motorways are highways which have a speed of 120km/h, are a dual carriageway or more, do not allow stopping and use the general "keep left" rules. They appear infrequently, mostly around big cities. The longest stretch links Tavora City and New Ledbury. Most mororways are tolled by private companies who also manage the maintainance of them. Motorways retain the route number of the A road from which it originates, but takes an M prefix instead.

Regional Highways (R), Local Highways (L) and unclassified roads follow.

The government built most of these roads during the early 2000s but no new construction is planned. Generally, the small motorway network serves the small country well. Most people live in dense urban buildings, with three-four floored townhouses. Outside of this, there are lots of villages and smaller towns dotted accross the country and people often build houses out in the country on already-built roads. Rich foreigners have holiday homes or build resorts on the beaches.

	History & culture
	A brief description of the intended culture and language

Cultures are mainly outlined here: https://imgur.com/94jHO3Y

The islands historically were known as the Kingdom of Aldevira and had four High Kings, one for each island. Sometime around the renaissance, Toçi Island and it's city of Debut became a major shipping port, not unlike Venice of our world. Toçi essentially broke off from the Kingdom (though not officially) By 1580, the Kingdom was basically dead and what remained were three small city states, Zavor, Debut and Tavori. While Debut was stunted by the size of its island, Zavor and Tavori were not. Unfortunately, Tavori was attacked and conquered by Ingerish colonials in 1673. The Ingerish rule in Tavora was long, but fortunately the native culture was not bothered. It was mostly used as an outpost for The Strait and Sabelic(?) Sea. As for Zavor, it grew rapidly after Tavori was out of the picture, eventually forming the Kingdom of Zavor. By the 18th Century, the islands were mostly peaceful. The Kingdom and Debut mostly stayed away from eachother, and both were weary of their neighbour to the south.

In 1754, there was a rebellion in Tavori that took the Ingerish off guard. After it was put down, they began to have a greater military presence in the area. In 1860, Debut and Zavor united into the (Second) Aldeviran Kingdom to deter the colonials. In 1873, Limain Island joined them. They were relatively peaceful until 1912, shortly after a period of famine caused by blight. This famine revealed the monarchy's ignorance and led to the rise of Sebastian Seferi and his radical followers. The rebellion, which started in Debut but soon spread across all three islands ended in the execution of the two royal families in what became known as Blood Square, Debut.

Sebastian Seferi was a military dictatorship. Seferi committed attrocities such as the Garza Massacre in 1925 when he had his soldiers open fire on a group of protestors, or the genocide of some minority groups in the country. (Seferi also founded planned towns such as Seferigard) In 1930, civil unrest reached its peak and the army divided into two, the Greens (supporting Seferi) and the Tans (supporting a better republic, named for their civillian clothing) The Tans wanted to stage a coup and replace the government. The coup was ultimately a success, and Seferi was imprisoned by 1932, and later exiled. In 1964, Tavora (who became independent in 1922), chose to join Aldevira, whose economy was growing steadily.

Below is the flag of the country since 1798.

https://imgur.com/a/ihlodmH

	Past mapping
	To support your request provide links to areas of OGF mapping which showcase your mapping skill. Mapping relevant to the requested theme & geography is especially useful
	The {{coord}} template can optionally be used to link to the OGF map - it results in a nice formatted link. Or you can paste in a URL.

I have been mapping in BG36: https://opengeofiction.net/#map=10/16.1059/-107.4477&layers=B for a while now using JOSM and the further west you go the more recent the mapping is. The mainland regions are based on Ireland however this island to the north: https://opengeofiction.net/#map=12/16.2284/-107.5331&layers=B is relevant to this territory application as it is based loosely on Jamaica. An example of my urban mapping can be found in Oliver City and an example of my rural mapping can be found in the countryside and in the forests and mountains where I have detailed some tourist destinations inspired by Co. Kerry, Ireland. (e.g. Farrowdown Lake: https://opengeofiction.net/#map=15/15.9933/-107.4693&layers=B)

I would also like for The town of Stricture to be moved to Tavora and help with how to do this.

	Username & date
	Sign and date the application by typing four tildes like this: ~~~~

Veni Vidi Vici (talk) 21:12, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

	Discussion
	Discussion for clarification & decision

Hi, the TA admin recently stepped down, and applications are currently not being accepted for the continent. Given the application was made before this, I will consider it. However, I have reduced the scope of the application to one of the territories. Please rework the application with this in mind, plus using the information at OpenGeofiction:Tarephia#North Tarephia to guide the culture. Thanks/wangi (talk) 08:22, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
I've updated the application and changed the culture and geography to fit it. Thanks for helping. If this gets accepted, I presume BG36 will be wiped clean. Thanks again, Veni Vidi Vici (talk) 16:43, 10 September 2024 (UTC)
Please think through the population density (5.5m / 4149.4km² = 1325 pop. per km²) and the level of development. Can you also explain how you see the proposed culture and theme working with the suggested: "Ellirian Peninsula: Greek, Spanish, perhaps Italian". Thanks/wangi (talk) 11:04, 11 September 2024 (UTC)
I will change the population to 2 Million, with a density average of around .00048 people/km² (I don't know if I did this right, but the population I estimated above was just for the purpose of this application and it wouldn't have been referenced elsewhere.) As for culture, I would gladly change the spanish regions to a more Illyrian culture (not mentioned here but modern day albanian with some greek and italian influences). As for Tavora and the Ingerish regions, I imagine the empire would have wanted a colony nearby The Strait. They will be based on places like Cyprus, Gibraltar or Malta. I have added more info on development. I really hope this is all of the things I left out or didn't provide enough information on because I have been waiting and waiting for donkey's years just trying to get a territory so I can map and have fun. Veni Vidi Vici (talk) 13:28, 11 September 2024 (UTC)
2 million gives you a population density of ~ 480 per km². For a reasonably useful comparison consider Trinidad and Tobago with a density of ~300. I'd suggest topping out at 1.5M. Honestly, it's the English use which is giving me pause for thought here. Replace that with Spanish (or your Illyrian idea, one or the other) and it would be much easier to approve. Thanks/wangi (talk) 15:26, 11 September 2024 (UTC)
I'll remove the English speaking parts, but could I keep that as part of its history (and as such still use some of the English names) My main inspiration is Malta, whose language has an italian influence and is in a (somewhat) similar region. It was under British rule or influence until atleast 1964, and is a rare case of European colonialism, in Europe. Another example is Gibraltar, similarily to The Dematisna Strait, it seperates North Africa and Europe. The only official language is English, but as far as I can tell most people use Spanish in everyday life (which is an example of the use of English names and Illyrian culture I mentioned above. ) I've updated the population. I know it requires a moving of the application, but to honour the fact that the territory now has no spanish influence, I would like to change it to a more Illyrian name: Aldevira (Aldeviran). The island of Capitán was renamed to Karnova, Hersey to Tavora, and its colonial history removed. I wont be updating the map, but it is innacurate now. Veni Vidi Vici (talk) 16:11, 11 September 2024 (UTC)

Hello, potential neighbor. Glad to see your application. My territory would be immediately opposite the narrow part of the sea from yours, should the application be approved. I have a few quick points and was hoping for a clarification just to make sure I understand correctly.

The culture around the Uthyran Sea has plenty of room for new things, but there absolutely should be a Hellenesian (Greek) substrate within it. From reading your application, it seems like you are including that, and that's good. It doesn't have to be surviving (see Pohenicia as an example where it does not), but it clearly influences many things from city design to architecture to toponymy and possibly some ancient family names.
Originally, when there were multiple Islamic-inspired African territories in northeast Tarephia, we had a Mazanic invasion in the 9th or 10th century in the region. While I do not know the exact state of this, you should be open to including that in your history at some point (even if no lasting legacy in the long run), given that your territory sits right at the gulf opening where those territories are found. The Tarephia guidelines indicate that the culture is possible in the region, so you might have to adapt down the road. You don't have to change anything now, but keep it in mind.
The region has long baked in a major Castellanese (Spanish) incursion that has been canon in our region since at least 2019. The timeline was in the 1440s and 1450s, the Castellanese took territory in the area, with Pohenicia falling in the middle of that. In Mauretia, the Castellanese initially took a few coastal cities like Nikopoli in an effort to gain a trading foothold. Pohenicia became independent not long after, but its Castellanese legacy was fully entrenched. In Mauretia, the coastal cities were eventually taken back over the next couple of decades.
Regarding the Ingerish and your timeline for that (and revolution), we do have a global canon of the Great War to consider. There are few fixed details (intentionally) other than that it was a series of regional things that blew up into a major global conflict in the late 1940s and in the early 1950s. The 1960 Pax Nova Games was part of a celebration of the ending of the war, but it would have needed a few years advance to build up to it. So, 1955 is probably a last-possible ending date to consider at this point. Now, the Great War was so horrifying to people, when it got so large with entangled alliances and whatnot that it effectively spooked the nations enough to creating the Assembly of Nations and falling into an unprecedented period of peace. Please consider how your country's conflict might be a spark in our region. Likewise, please consider how the Ingerish might have responded accordingly if you are insistent in using them. They shouldn't be a colonial or even major occupying force in this region after 1920.
For clarification: A Maltese homeland exists not far away in Kalkara, but it wouldn't have been a colonial influence.

All that said for the purposes of cluing you into our region, I would ask a quick clarification on some things. Am I correct that you will not be using Spanish influences in your territory? Please consider the points I made above about the Ingerish and clarify their role, also. Thanks! Good luck with the application. — Alessa _(talk) 01:59, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Hi, with regards to colonialism, I did originally have Capitán and Limain (now Karnova and Toçi) be Spanish colonies but decided to change it yesterday to Illyrian, sort of an Albanian culture. Historically, the Illyrian's bordered the Greeks so I think it makes sense in this territory (also fits with the italian guideline somewhat) As for the Castallanese incursion, would there have been any way around it? I would gladly add some Spanish colonial streetplans and architecture and things like that but uf there could have been any way for the small island chain to somehow get out of it, I'd be open to it. I can change my timeline for the Ingerish, but I do know that I want there to have been a military dictatorship there at some point. Thanks for your help, and hopefully our potential neighbourship will go well, Veni Vidi Vici (talk) 06:26, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

If you are going to use Illyrian as the basis for your country's underlying culture, that seems reasonable. At the same time, keep in mind the caveat that we have an Albanian-culture territory (Malesoria) relatively far away. If you're sticking to a unique take on old Illyrian (as opposed to any potential Albanian evolution to the modern that may have happened), there shouldn't be an issue. If it is going to drift too close to Albanian, I'm probably going to have to object a little.

Regarding the Castellanese incursion into the area, it is mostly driven by Pohenicia's immediate proximity and the nearby other former Castellanese colonies to the south. You'd be sandwiched between them, so I don't see a logical way of avoiding it completely. That said, it doesn't mean there needs to be a big deal made of it in your mapping. One possible explanation was a brief, incomplete takeover by the Castellanese (like what happened to some parts of coastal Mauretia), and even that didn't last long or leave a lasting legacy for some reason. Just come up with a clever way for the Castellanese to leave: either insular revolts, granting of special trade privileges (they get what they want without having to occupy the territory and suppress it), different levels of vassalage, or even just a plain 'the Castellanese didn't find anything of value worth holding on to.' I'd even be willing to have Mauretia 'help out,' if that's useful to you. Maybe there was some economic or religious connection that made Mauretia not just expel the Castellanese from her coastal cities but also take the short hop across and help out on your islands. We can talk about that later via PM if it is of interest. Point being, you'd only have to have Castellan in your historical timeline to accommodate the history of the region, but it doesn't have to have a noticeable footprint on the map. It could be as simple as a huge statue in the capital about victory over the Castellanese or something like that. — Alessa _(talk) 13:45, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

I think I need to drop my five cents regarding Malesoria. According to their country article Malesoria was a part of Demirhan Empire between 15-19th century (relevant section of the Malesoria article). Roughly at the same time Demirhan Empire established Demirhan Tarephian Khedivate just south of TA032 so interest in TA032 could be easy to explain, as well as the fact why it was settled almost exclusively by Malesorians/Albanians - the empire heavily experimented with large scale resettlement multiple times. Rustem Pasha (talk) 14:18, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

I have created this history for the country pre 1800 which I'll swap for the current one if it is all correct, dates line up and it makes sense. It might also explain the Illyrian culture of the islands and how they escaped Spanish influence.

The original, native tribes of this region, lets call them the Aldevirans came from Pohenicia and spoke a dialect of their tongue (does Pohenicia have a wiki page? I can't find one), which slowly evolved over time into Old Aldeviran. In the 16th Century, the Demirhan Empire stopped on the island of Tavori (locally known as something else) where they set up the trading port of Tavora. They quickly moved across the four islands, founding Zavor sometime around 1586. They didn't go far from the coast. Due to its proximity to the mainland, the northwestern parts of Karnova were undeveloped. The culture of the natives mixed in quickly with the Demirihans. The mixture of the two languages eventually resulted in Middle Aldeviran which has much more prominent Demiran features (but also closely resembles the albanian-like language spoken in Malësoria, which was spoken by a large majority of the settlers)

During this time, the city states began to form and although they were part of the Demirhan Empire, and exported resources and worked as a shipping waystation for them the cities could essentially govern themselves. They thrived under this rule.

Sometime around 1691, the Castallanese took a moment of Demirhan weakness (any idea what this could be?) and seized control of the islands, which they had their eye on for a while. The locals despised their new ownership, who enforced harsh laws against their culture and tried to convert them to Catholicism (is this the religion of Castallán?) which outraged the Aldevirans even more. They founded a few coastal towns, though all of them have had their names changed since. The only exclave they managed to successfully colonise was a coastal area in the southwest of Tavora where the port of Fernando still stands. The city states had less autonomy during this time, and several rebellions tried and failed to oust the colonials.

In 1770, there was a succesful rebellion in Aldevira and the Castallanese were forced to leave. The rebels employed guerilla tactics and focused on areas of the country where they would have high local support. In conclusion, the Castallanese had little effect on the culture of the country except for a few new words and phrases in what would become Modern Aldeviran, the one spoken today. They also converted some regions of the country to Catholicism, but Islam remained the majority, all the way up to modern times. (Today there are much less Catholics, as they were sometimes excluded by others in Aldevira for siding with the Castallenese. Lots of them moved to Castallanese colonies or to Archanta as colonists.

(post-1800 history)

Veni Vidi Vici (talk) 16:19, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

Speaking of moment of weakness, Demirhan Empire was focused on conquer of Lorantis around 1692-3 (Lorantis is roughly here^∈^⊾) and nearby island of Şneldorf. I imagine it, at least partially as large scale naval war, which would require engagement of almost entire fleet. Castellan could use it as advantage to sneak to Tavori and take it over. Also take into consideration that main language of Demirhan is just Turkish and already large chunk of Turkish vocab is present in Albanian/Malesorian. Rustem Pasha (talk) 19:24, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

That sounds good, I'll update the history when I have the time. Veni Vidi Vici (talk) 22:19, 12 September 2024 (UTC)

	Territory application approved
	Approved. Please continue dialogue with the neighbouring territory stakeholders on some of the finer details. Thanks/wangi (talk) 16:16, 13 September 2024 (UTC)
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